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glen45
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16 posts
Jan-18-03, 03:59 PM (EDT)
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"dyno results"
 
   I just did 2 dyno pulls can I e mail the pics to somebody and could you post them I am way rich on the air fuel ratio e mail glenh34@excite.com

97 lsc


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-18-03 1
     RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-18-03 2
         RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-18-03 3
             RE: dyno results glen45 Jan-18-03 4
                 RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 5
                     RE: dyno results ponyfreakmoderator Jan-19-03 6
                         RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-19-03 7
                             RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-19-03 8
                                 RE: dyno results DOHC MARK VIIIteam Jan-19-03 9
                                     RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 10
                                         RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 11
                                             RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-19-03 12
                                             RE: dyno results BigBill Jan-19-03 13
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 14
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 15
                                             RE: dyno results glen45 Jan-19-03 16
                                             RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-19-03 17
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 18
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 19
                                             RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-19-03 20
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-19-03 21
                                             RE: dyno results calviromanteam Jan-20-03 22
                                             RE: dyno results nysbadmk8 Jan-20-03 23

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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-18-03, 07:31 PM (EDT)
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1. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #0
 
   fishmanx@optonline.net

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-18-03, 11:25 PM (EDT)
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2. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #1
 
  

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-18-03, 11:26 PM (EDT)
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3. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #2
 
   your running reallllllllll fat... and your power is about 10-15 hp off stock dynos

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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glen45
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16 posts
Jan-18-03, 11:55 PM (EDT)
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4. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #3
 
   Thanks again for posting the pics. for me. It was 70 bucks for the first 2 runs and will be 50 for the next 2 Wauconda IL. All stock except for 2 dynomax ultra flows. I have an lms chip coming next week. I plan on doing a maf & filter upgrade copper plugs. What is the ideal air - fuel ratio? the guys that did the dyno said 13 ? any suggestions to get these numbers up?

97 lsc


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 00:13 AM (EDT)
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5. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #4
 
   13 to 13.5 is ideal for N/a


your power is off a good bit.. do a tune up on your car while your at it

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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ponyfreakmoderator
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Jan-19-03, 10:15 AM (EDT)
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6. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #5
 
   wow you are richer than I am. I thought I was really rich at 11.8.
Just like Pete said, you car is down on power. SOme of this is due to it running rich. I think the rest of it is things like plugs, and wires, ect. Swap everything out,then run it again.

Drivetrain Moderator
95 Pearl Mark VIII
HEAVILY modified
94 Red Mark VIII -220rwhp



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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-19-03, 11:38 AM (EDT)
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7. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #6
 
   I think your results are about average for a stock gen 2. I compared my stock dyno chart to yours and the curves are very similar. They do run a tad rich stock - to protect the motor. The dyno sheet looks very nice and believable, unlike a few posted recently that were a big mess. Your car actually made more peak HP than mine did stock, and more than several others that I have seen sheets on. I think your taking a step in the right direction by getting a chip - just be sure that Geno removes the 4800rpm limiter on 3-4 WOT shifts (affects 96 up only) or you will be severely limited if you ever choose to do any high speed runs - especially with lower gears, in which case this will become a problem as low as 90mph (4.10's) or 100mph (3.73's). May want to consider the MotorCraft AGSF-12FM1 plugs, which can take a bit more timing advance - great in cunjunction w/ Geno's chip. Good luck and let us know how things go after the chip install!!!


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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-19-03, 12:48 PM (EDT)
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8. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #7
 
   To be a bit more specific- I made a point by point comparason of our 2 cars - stock -to stock and came up with the following:

RPM Your HP My HP Your TQ My TQ
------------------------------------------
4000 163.6 165 214.8 219
4500 185.2 188 216.2 219
5000 198.4 200 208.4 210
5500 204.2 196 195.0 189
6000 204.2 193 178.8 169

This was a baseline dyno run done by JW and Dennis (so you know it was done right) After the dyno tune, I had gains of +19 HP and +15 FT*LB @6000 rpm, and even @ 2000 rpm, there was a +8 HP and +22 FT*LB gain. One advantage of them doing the dyno, was the car can be electronically locked in 3rd, allowing a run from about 2K up without any shifting.

As far as your car being allegedly underpowered, I dont buy it. People talk, but when they actually "chest up" your sheet vs another STOCK gen 2 sheet on the same dyno in similar conditions- I think you wouldnt hear much from them. I have seen 4 stock gen 2 sheets and you are "average", which is good!


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DOHC MARK VIIIteam
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2492 posts
Jan-19-03, 01:40 PM (EDT)
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9. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #8
 
I agree with Cal, the normal "stock" numbers for unmodified Mark VIII's is usually 205 to 210. There're just too many varibles from dyno to dyno even if everything is corrected to SAE standards for a standard day. You've got a good starting point. All things considered, allowing for mileage and state of tune, you may even be doing slightly better than average. Enjoy your ride and have fun in the future.

--Bill--
LOD Charter Member since 8/7/99
LOD Board of Directors

95 Mark VIII LSC-R For Pic's and Mods click here



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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 03:22 PM (EDT)
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10. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #9
 
   Sorry i tought it was a First gen... for a second gen im guessing those numbers are normal.. But steves 2nd gen dynos i think where 245rwhp with just chip, and exhaust

i still cant see how your loseing almost 35% of your power in the driveline... Too high

290hp stock 207 to the wheels... your loseing 83hp THATS alot

So im still going to suggest you drop in some colder plugs, a new pcv valve, and new fuel filter.. And your loseing a good bit of Hp running 11:1

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 03:24 PM (EDT)
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11. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #10
 
   LAST EDITED ON Jan-19-03 AT 03:29 PM (EDT)
 
heres a question that will help us Sea-levelers... What Altitude did you dyno at?


also here is steves dyno

http://community.webshots.com/photo/28004220/28004268XNZHHFYfaM


243 hp and 256 tq in 2nd gear

I think your numbers are off 10hp or so

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-19-03, 05:51 PM (EDT)
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12. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #11
 
   I dont know that you can really compare Steve's run with his being in second gear. I am just not sure of the effect that running in 2nd would have. I dont have dyno sheets to back it up - but I feel that my car is much stronger in the cold. To put a number on it - the car "feels" like it has a solid 20 ft*lb torque gain throught the usable rpm range on a 30 deg. day verses a 95 deg day. Maybe Steves run was on a 45 deg day with high barometric pressure. I know my run was on a 98 degree Florida day, with dyno bay temps slightly higher.


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BigBill
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1101 posts
Jan-19-03, 06:20 PM (EDT)
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13. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #12
 
   Thats RITCH. Ideal is like 12.7-13.2ish.
Thats about right on the numbers, Paul's (Lowslung) with no mods on a gen1 got 204RWHP, and like 245rwtq. But the tune got him like 30RWHP. And he dident have all of his mantinence, but you get the idea.


BigBill's Black 96 S/C

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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 06:33 PM (EDT)
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14. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #13
 
   2nd gear pull is less efficent...

steves dyno was on a 65-75 degree day...

my stock dyno was 232rwhp... then again my car ran 14.7 @ 98mph stock too guess i had a strong car

i guess 207 seems too low... Thats alot of driveline loses over 27%

see for a gen1 to pull 220rwhp thats normal thats a 60hp loss in the driveline about 21%

but you do it like that 290 gets you 207 to the wheels 83hp loss 29%!!!

glen... get your A/F ratio cleaned up, do plugs, pvc, fuel filter, maybe a bottle of techron

and then lets see where your at...


Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 06:35 PM (EDT)
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15. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #14
 
   LAST EDITED ON Jan-19-03 AT 06:39 PM (EDT)
 
see another problem i see... Is he's only pulling 217 ft lbs of tourqe... THATS WAY LOW... the 255 reading isa shift spike...

so he's missing 30 ft lbs of tourqe too!


yea theres deffinetly something up with your car glen... * I THINK *

your horsepower reading are on the low side


Now as for the tourqe i dont think anybody can come up with an excuse for 217 ft lbs of tourqe... Most mk8's gen1 or gen 2 pull over 240 easy

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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glen45
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16 posts
Jan-19-03, 07:13 PM (EDT)
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16. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #15
 
   LAST EDITED ON Jan-19-03 AT 07:21 PM (EDT)
 
It was probably abought 20 degrees outside 1 hour drive to the dyno place car sat for 45 min. outside then I drove it for less than 5 min they pulled it in did the dyno. I am new to this they entered the car info asked about mods = none do the lsc gears make any difference ? if they were not entered into computer ? I,ll put in a bottle of valvoline injector cleaner good stuff new copper plugs pcv lms chip and see what happens. Also if the maf sensor is dirty that might throw it off on air fuel? I saw on a website that a high % of recalibrations are really dirty sensors. car has 88 k on it maybe original plugs? also for a plug change taking some plastic a bag or saran wrap and putting it between extensions and plug socket and tapping it together holds everything in place solid. Its abought a high temp of twenty degrees outside here in Chicago anybone see a problem changing plugs on an ice cold motor ? I think I,ll buy a tourque wrench the last thing I need is a helicoil. I think they messed up one of the pulls had a hard time staying in third. thanks Glen

97 lsc


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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-19-03, 07:24 PM (EDT)
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17. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #16
 
   Pete - mine only had about 2-3 ft*lb more torque than his had. And mine looked similar to 2 other gen 2 owners sheets I looked at. My car did pick up a good amount though after the tune.


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 07:40 PM (EDT)
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18. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #17
 
   then your car was dynoing low too...

90% of the stock mk8's dyno over 235 tourqe 240 is more normal

glen just do the plugs, fuel filter, pcv, some techron, oil shouldnt matter

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 07:42 PM (EDT)
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19. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #18
 
   calvin... you also dynoed in 98 degrees weather and got his numbers, he dyno'ed in 20 degree weather every 10 degrees is about %2 now add 10-14% to your numbers... your at 230/240

Now do you see how his numbers are low?

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-19-03, 09:49 PM (EDT)
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20. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #19
 
   I thought he was @ 70.8 degrees? The dyno sheet says the IAT was 70 degrees??? Oh ya - if it was 20 degrees then those ###'s are low.


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-19-03, 10:05 PM (EDT)
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21. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #20
 
   ok... lets make this easy...

you engine its hot! the heat dissapates every where... your intake box, your intake tubes etc...

in 98 degree weather My IATS are about 140 degrees Not moving

in 20 degree weather they are about 50 degrees not moving


the air outside maybe 20 degrees but you pick up heat from the engine, rad. etc.

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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calviromanteam
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1361 posts
Jan-20-03, 10:46 AM (EDT)
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22. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #21
 
   I didn't think that with the hood up and fans blowing directly on the motor on a 20 degree day the IAT would get that high! I knew that it would be warmer than outside by maybe 10-15 degrees - but not 50 degrees (especially with the hood open with fans).

I have one of those "inside/outside" thermometers and just out of curiousity I drove around with the outside sensor in various locations in my engine bay. The temps IN FORWARD MOTION were not all that high (with it jammed in the nooks and crannies of the back of the intake manifold the temp was about 25 degrees higher than outside). Now once you stop at a red light the temp shoots up pretty fast - about another 20 degrees in a minute. Bottom line is that I think there is good air flow across/around a gen 2 motor while in motion. Dont know about gen 1's (different grill, hood, ect)


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nysbadmk8
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3738 posts
Jan-20-03, 06:52 PM (EDT)
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23. "RE: dyno results"
In response to message #22
 
   belive it or not 20-30 degree diffrence is normal while moving

50-60 while stopped

Metro Marks Chapter founder
2002 Trans Am Black on Black
500hp N/a 10 second slips and Nitrous too!
1996 Mark VIII 70k <-- stock (haha not for long!)


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